Bullshit is a great word, and no, it is not outrageously crude or outrageous .. I use it all the time.......love it.

Posted by Billy Bob Henry | reply to this comment
May 12, 2008 3:51 pm

Personally I think it was inoffensively unwordly but that is just me (go to synonyms.com if you don't get it). On a more thoughtfull note, I hope that San Diego is gradually starting to see a clearer picture of the people who run this place. Hopefully, over time people will begin to not expect that their leadership is pius, omniscient and infallible; because no one really is (not even your priest or his pope). In turn their leadership will learn that it is okay to make mistakes and to truly do what they believe should be done. Afterall, wasn't that our greatest sin? Covering up the mistakes of the past, and by doing that, not fixing them? Maybe this is the start of seeing past the serpent's ruse?

Posted by Basic Civics | reply to this comment
May 12, 2008 4:48 pm

BBH, you don't just use the word, you live it. You own it. Best, Algernon

Posted by Algernon Sidney | reply to this comment
May 12, 2008 6:53 pm

Kittle would no more complain about Sainz than McGrath would complain about Aguirre. The fact Sanders and Aguirre dismiss the diatribe each of their top deputies sent is telling. The fact Sanders offered an honest feeling to Francis is refreshing but still telling. If one cannot convey his/her message of displeasure, point of view or frustration free of swear words, conveys only the individuals lack of professionalism. To convey in a private conversation ones message laced with profanity is unacceptable but less offensive than writing and sending an email laced with the same. Sanders cannot continue to allow Sainz the freedom to thumb his nose at City Policies regarding behaviour, if he intends on holding City employees accountable to the public for the same. Sanders must demand his top deputies model the behaviour he expects and Sanders must lead by example; rising above the fray.

Posted by Steve McMillan | reply to this comment
May 12, 2008 8:03 pm

This issue is not so much that Fred Sainz used profanity in a message to the U-T -- written, it appears, on a city computer -- but rather that Jerry Sanders has declared publicly that he will not discipline Sainz for his actions. Any other city employee caught violating city policy would be disciplined. I know someone who was -- and it wasn't because of an email this person sent, but one that the person received. Leadership starts at the top; in this case, it fails to start at the top. The next city employee threatened with discipline for a similar action should take the case to Civil Service, using the Sainz memo and lack of discipline as the primary argument that punishment is not meted out fairly.

Posted by Dave Cohen | reply to this comment
May 12, 2008 10:03 pm

BBH,go to Amazon and buy the book "On Bullshit" by philosopher Harry Frankfurt.I'm not being tongue in cheek here, or even implying anything.I keep a couple of copies around to hand out like bible tracts when I need to.Dave Cohen basically cuts to the core of the argument here.I might occasionally use profanity in conversation with friends, but would never, ever use it in contact with the public or in an email.Note to editor, speaking of etiquette and proper English, could you please set the comment box to allow spaces between sentences and allow paragraphs?

Posted by JF | reply to this comment
May 13, 2008 9:59 am

OK, when I use the BS word, I use it with friends and people I know, and in private. I thought that was a given but it appears some people here think that I was speaking the word in public without regard for the public. I use the word in private, like many other people do, in private. I would not use it on a computer other than my personal computer and personal email. And Dave Cohen is right about setting two different standards-but that has been, and always will be, how government works.

Posted by Billy Bob Henry | reply to this comment
May 14, 2008 4:07 pm

Are you all just figuring out that grown-ups use bad words? Do you expect those in charge to never let one out? Starting with Sanders...he said something to Francis and the only reason we know is because Francis tattled. Sainz -- I admit I didn't follow this one too closely. Is Fred Sainz the first official to use profanity in an e-mail? Did Bob Kittle complain? I'm a little factless on this one. If it was just uncovered for no real reason, I don't really care what it said. I'm not sure someone should be disciplined for using profanity in an e-mail if there is no complaint. Was there one? What kind of discipline would one get anyway? A warning not to do it again...

Posted by Ann | reply to this comment
May 14, 2008 5:32 pm

And regarding the last example by Nancy Graham, I guess that was in an interview. Seems to me she should have chosen her words more carefully. Sure it doesn't have the same effect, but was it not also a "stupid argument"? I'd say that's the one I have the biggest problem with -- a public official speaking publically using profanity. And then there is Scott Lewis trying to change the Voice into something more like the Reader or CityBeat? Don't go there. Profanity doesn't make you cool. Last comment -- see this is the problem with San Diego -- we get more upset over profanity than about real issues.

Posted by Ann | reply to this comment
May 14, 2008 5:40 pm

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